From: Todd Puccio <[log in to unmask]>
Date: Fri, 16 May 2014 13:50:12 +0000

Thank You Sandy.

Just like anybody else, college faculty members will try to make their
jobs easier.  Some of the new Online Class materials offer that.
But, nothing is free.

The faculty just don't realize how much it costs their students. And
maybe they don't care.  Textbook and Classroom support materials have
always been the responsibility of the student.  It is part of the cost
of a university education.  An art student buys his/her own supplies.

This is isn't primary school.  The classroom doesn't have an arts and
crafts or a book budget.

Open Textbooks may offer some help :

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=14&ved=0CHgQFjAN&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cnn.com%2F2014%2F04%2F18%2Fliving%2Fopen-textbooks-online-education-resources%2F&ei=VBR2U_KGJcWXqAaL44CwCg&usg=AFQjCNEga0gGQfHgXDIQyKSCF-oWrZ5pyA&bvm=bv.66699033,d.b2k


Todd Puccio
Director of Technical Services / Librarian
Nova Southeastern University
Health Professions Division Library
Ft. Lauderdale, FL 33328
[log in to unmask]







-----Original Message-----
From: LibLicense-L Discussion Forum
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of LIBLICENSE
Sent: Thursday, May 15, 2014 11:51 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Textbooks and coercion and librarians

From: Sandy Thatcher <[log in to unmask]>
Date: Thu, 15 May 2014 00:25:39 -0500

Despite everything you say here, Chuck, my point remains: no one is
"forcing" professors or the universities to buy these products. There
is no "law" that mandates such purchases. If students don't like what
their professors are requiring them to sign up for, they should
protest to the professors, not the publishers or state legislators.
Students have NEVER had a choice about what textbooks they are being
asked to purchase. Yes, as Peggy emphasized, they could normally opt
for used textbooks, or borrow copies from fellow students, in the
print era; but they still had to use the textbooks assigned. The
professors hold the power here, and THEY are not being coerced by
anyone. Why is this simple point so hard to grasp? The best solution
might be for libraries to get more involved in publishing open
textbooks themselves, following the lead of places like SUNY-Geneseo.

Sandy Thatcher


> From: "Hamaker, Charles" <[log in to unmask]>
> Date: Wed, 14 May 2014 05:37:20 +0000
>
> Coercion in this instance is when students are forced through a
> mandatory fee  above tuition and normal fees in order to even take the
> tests or do the homework for a class.  The normal expectation until
> quite recently is tests and homework were part of what you "got" with
> the course. That has been flipped on its head, or tail...
>
> Publisher's sell through for a simple textbook, no "web" additions, is
> about 35% according to industry sources. 35% of students buy a new
> copy. This scheme forces 100% of students to make a publisher provided
> purchase. What publisher isn't going to love that! thus the deep
> discounts for proven mandatories, even though its mandatory in these
> courses whether the university or professor has gotten it rolled into
> typical lab fee structures or not.
>
> Of course the main focus is introductory courses where the largest
> enrollment figures are. $170 for an introductory Spanish course (with
> web access) is abusive and opportunistic. And 1,500 students a year
> for that first semester. Its nice the book is also usable for the
> second semester. Sure, the department is "saving" instruction costs by
> making the course 50% "online" and 35% of the grade dependent on
> homework. In this instance tests are face to face.
>
> But classroom contact time is reduced to an hour and fifteen minutes a
> week. The department and ultimately the university are taking
> advantage of cheaper "instructors" who are running 4 of these courses
> apiece a semester but that cost is on top of student costs of almost
> $200,000 for the textbook package gross  (with of course multiple
> sections) , Multiple that by a few other campuses using Punto de
> Partida and you have some real money being made off forced student
> purchases .Other intro course packages include Psych, Math, Stats,
> Chem, Geography, etc. even some liberal studies courses. I have a lis
> of 100 and 200 level courses requiring web access at my university.
> The numbers are significant, the courses have a combined headcount
> figure of over 10,000 students.
>
> The average cost of a college textbook has gone up about 812% since
> 1978. The average cost of medical services in the same time period is
> up 575%, Textbook prices are more out of control than medical
> services! That's the very definition of a dysfunctional market.  see
> the graph
> at:http://www.aei-ideas.org/2012/12/the-college-textbook-bubble-and-ho
> w-the-open-educational-resources-movement-is-going-up-against-the-text
> book-cartel/
>
> The national system being created of forced student purchase,
> mandatory purchases of publisher website access is gaining speed. I've
> mentioned Minnesota but there's also Baylor's pilot with Follett
> bookstore for 100% mandatory fees for such content.  If your campus is
> going the mandatory fee route, please let me know.
>
> Whatever the causes, and letting publishers off the hook is not the
> solution, this is a national disaster. It is directly counter to the
> 2008 Higher Education law intention which mandates more clarity in
> pricing, requesting universities provide pricing info at registration
> and that publishers "unbundle"  content to provide more choice- ironic
> given the current trends we are discussing. For more on the 2008 law
> requirements on disclosure which most campuses  and many publishers
> are ignoring,  see
> http://www.studentpirgs.org/resources/textbook-price-disclosure-law
>
> A new print copy plus web access for University Physics (mastering
> Physics w/access) by Pearson for introductory Physics is $309.00 Many
> thousands of students nationally are required to purchase this
> package. (over 1,000 just at my university)
>
> Again, captive purchasers, mandatory purchasing, forced, ie. coercive
> purchases . Its time for some sixties level action on the part of
> students, and vigilance because of the draconian terms of the
> contracts from those supposedly "in loco parentis" We ought to know
> better given the abusive behavior of publishers over the last 30 years
> in pricing journals. They will take advantage of captive markets.
>
> Chuck Hamaker
>
> PS if you have copies of the EULAS required of faculty and students to
> access any of the big 4 publisher's websites  I would like to ask you
> send them to me. The big four are Pearson, Cengage, McGraw Hill and
> Wiley.
>
> Perhaps we could discuss remediation principles for these EULAS?